EXCLUSIVE! Shobhaa Dé wants Kangana Ranaut or Nicole Kidman to play her on screen

Shobhaa Dé is widely known for her sharp writing and scintillating personality but her kindness is the first thing that comes to mind when I think of her. Several years ago, when I was much younger, she offered me – a complete stranger – a lift in her car when I was stranded without any transport after the launch of a book. She saw me alone and a bit lost, without any help at hand, so she came up to me and asked where I wanted to go. We were headed to the same art gallery, so she invited me to join her. I will never forget that gesture.

When an opportunity to interview her at the 14^th edition of Tata Literature Live! presented itself this weekend, I jumped at it immediately. Here are some excerpts from a leisurely conversation with Dé, about her thoughts on cinema, food, her thirst for adventure, LGBTQ rights in India, life at 75 years of age, and changes in the Indian publishing industry.

Which actor would you recommend if someone wanted to make a biopic on your life?

Kangana Ranaut! I am not talking about her current persona, of course. I don’t always understand what she is doing, or why she is saying something. But I like the fact that she challenges the status quo. She can take on the system, and do things on her own terms. She has a very strong sense of self. She has guts. She speaks her mind. She is gorgeous to look at.

Which filmmaker would you trust with such a biopic?

Vikramaditya Motwane, who made Jubilee! It is a terrifically nuanced piece of work. I found it really compelling as a viewer. It didn’t have a star cast, yet I didn’t want to miss a single moment. That’s good art. If I could mention one more name, I’d say Martin Scorsese. Why should I limit my ambition to India? Killers of the Flower Moon, his latest film, put me in a trance. It is so detailed, so deep. Let these filmmakers fight for the rights of my biopic.

If Martin makes it, I would like Nicole Kidman to play me. I like the way she conducts herself. There is a certain cat-like, contained grace and a sense of self-assurance as a woman and a performer. If I wanted a wilder version of me, it would be Penélope Cruz. But I don’t have that kind of sex appeal. I can identify better with Nicole’s aloofness and remoteness.

You have written about your constant search for newness. What’s new in your life?

When I wake up in the morning, I like to have this sweet sense of anticipation. It does not have to be something big. It could be something new for breakfast, perhaps something that my children may have recommended. I want to begin my day feeling like I have something to look forward to. There is something very childlike about this. I like being thrilled.

I remember reading that you asked a Michelin star chef to serve gobi manchurian with vanilla ice cream and chilli flakes. How did this idea come into your head?

Most Michelin star chefs, unlike that one, are so narcissistic. They think they know it all. Nobody can know everything about food, art or literature. If you think that you know everything, in my opinion, you are already dead. Their entire career is based on snob appeal. If they can do outrageous things with food and call it nouvelle cuisine, then why not gobi manchurian with vanilla ice cream and chilli flakes? I was just being wicked and naughty.

You have been a vocal supporter of LGBTQ rights in India. What did you think of the recent Supreme Court verdict that denied legal recognition for marriage equality?

I think that the decriminalization of homosexuality in 2018 broke one big barrier. The recent verdict is basically a way of telling the community: “Hold on, guys, it’s going to happen.” In my mind, there is not even an iota of doubt that things will change from the way they are. The court is preparing our society, and nudging it in the right direction. I see their guidelines in a positive light. They are pushing the envelope for sure, one step at a time.

You have written about how you’ve dealt with your wounds by playing ostrich for the most part. To what extent has that worked out for you? How do you look back at it?

Unless it is a clinical issue, for which you need to see a professional, I think that time itself sorts things out. I was referring mostly to emotional decisions that I made, and the impact they had on me and on others. In 75 years, I have learnt that if you rush things, and want to sort themselves out then and there, in a state of panic, you often cause more damage. On the other hand, if you let things be for a while, and wait, answers often present themselves.

I enjoyed reading your book Insatiable. Did you have a lot of fun while writing it?

Yes! I believe that the process of writing a book should be pleasurable, not painful. If it seems like a burden, you are probably writing the wrong book. If you are not enjoying yourself, it means that your passion and energy are somewhere else. Or it means that you have become so self-conscious that you want to write the perfect book. There is no such thing. The perfect book does not exist at all. That’s why my mantra is simple: Don’t revisit. Don’t rewrite. Just let it flow like a stream of consciousness. Make it fun for yourself. The book will find its audience; those people who will appreciate the authenticity of your voice.

When I hold my book, I hold it with pride. Jaisi bhi hai, it is mine. It has got a lot of my emotions and experiences in it. It has my sense of humour and mischief. Of course, it had to be provocative. What’s the point of writing a book that is not provocative? I wanted to make people think. I am not a crowd pleaser. I have never done that, and I am not going to.

How has the Indian publishing scene changed between your first book and last one?

Oh, it has changed so much! It has become unrecognizable. Like Bollywood has become corporatized, and everything goes through various levels, agencies, minders, and barriers before you get to the movie stars and directors, publishing too has become hierarchical.

I call it the algorithm school of publishing. It is not necessarily about talent. It is about your social media presence. It is about how many likes you have, and how much excitement you can generate. In a lot of meetings in publishing houses, when a writer’s name is thrown out there, the marketing team decides who is worth publishing and who is not. They quickly go online, search for the writer’s name, and say: Oh, not bad! So many followers on Instagram! So many followers on Twitter! This person is an influencer. Let’s sign the person up. This has nothing to do with content, subject, talent or quality of writing. It’s only about numbers.

How do you manage to be read and noticed in this kind of environment?

I focus on my writing, and then let the publishers bother about the rest. It is not my burden to carry as a writer. My job is to write my book. If they think that it is worth publishing, they will put some money behind promoting it. Of course, as a writer, I want my book to reach as widely as possible. If writers didn’t want to be read, they’d just sit and write diaries, isn’t it?

Writers thrive on a certain level of vanity, which is not a bad thing. If you are not vain, you won’t really care about your writing. Vanity helps with quality control. I think it would be really arrogant for a writer to say: “Main genius hoon! I am just so amazing.” You cannot dish out just about anything because your publisher wants a book within a certain timeframe. You have to be aware of who you are, what you stand for, and what you want to put out.

Chintan Girish Modi is a freelance writer, journalist and book reviewer based in Mumbai. He is @chintanwriting on Instagram and X (formerly Twitter).

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